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[Eagle of Fire]

You guys always make me laugh when guys like you make such calculations and assume it's the absolute truth. Not that there is no truth to it, but anyways... If there is something I learned in my gaming days is that you never have 100% of the informations available to you in a game. For example, the fact that you win some extra accuracy if you kneel or lose some accuracy if you carry something in your offhand while holding a two hand weapon is extremely badly documented, if at all. Things like that throw calculation off most of the time.

I am certainly not dissing your way of playing, but it's certainly not the one I'd use. The Laser Vs Plasma argument, for example, been up since almost the first day UFO was released and is still raging on to this date....

By the way, did you know that most big aliens are particularly resistant to explosions? The only way to really hurt them with a grenade is to aim exactly where they are so the full blast hit them...

[gregor]

I like grenades. first turn i have some people throw flares and look arround (or just look arround) and then i spray the place with grenades. also for small rooms i throw one or two inside...

I haven't played UFO so much (mostly i played XCOM). in that one it is particulary useful to train them with grenades for terror sites (where oyu can't use rocket launchers). it pays a bit to have later you man being able to throw powerfull grenade through the whole map.

so i implied same tactics here in UFO. although i have to admit UFO has more obstacles. But i usually throw grenades to open walls r hit aliens that are hiding behind it. if you can't see it but you know they are there just throw a grenade inside and have someone aim in that place in case alien survives.

Also alines always hide in certain places so if you throw the grenades there chances are you will hit something. and that's also the reason why i use cannons a lot. i shoot in some place and if there is no sound i throw a grenade and then they die.

[Japo]

Originally Posted by Eagle of Fire

You guys always make me laugh when guys like you make such calculations and assume it's the absolute truth. Not that there is no truth to it, but anyways... If there is something I learned in my gaming days is that you never have 100% of the informations available to you in a game. For example, the fact that you win some extra accuracy if you kneel or lose some accuracy if you carry something in your offhand while holding a two hand weapon is extremely badly documented, if at all. Things like that throw calculation off most of the time.

Well these figures are the same that the game uses to calculate your success or failure, so they are meaningful, you can disregard them if you want but then you won't be able to know which option is really better, of course you can rely on personal taste instead. About the bonus for kneeling and the penalty for one hand, it's too easy to calcuate them with the accuracy percentages provided when you click on the weapon, they're around 15% and 20% if I remember right. However they don't affect comparisons between different weapons since they're the same for whichever one; only if it's worth it to kneel in a given situation etc. And I don't think this gives pistols any advantage over two-handed weapons, it's only 2 TUs to drop whatever a soldier has in one hand (he can pick it up again later) whenever he must shoot so he's not penalized for the weapon in the other.

These calculations are the only way to know each weapon's worth and compare them, everything else is random rolls and range modifiers (again equal for all weapons). The fact that many people won't make them doesn't mean they're not the only objective measure of the weapons' usefulness.

[Eagle of Fire]

What you just said is exactly what make you mathematicians reasoning flawed. "It's only 2 TU to drop it". Yeah, but then you need to pick it up again. And then, you might actually need those 2 TU at that particular time to save the life of your other squaddy... Those odds, you fail to calculate.

If we weed out both of our reasoning to what exactly make the difference between you and me, I'm willing to wage it all come down to the fact that all my own reasoning is done with suffering the fewer casualties possible, while you have effeciency in your top priority.

[another_guest]

Well, if anything I think these discussions mean that they made most of the weapons well-balanced and besides that created a game that outlived its supposed successors by many years.