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[chumloofah]

On an unimaginative note, I thought Transformers was top deck, ooh wah.
Proves that I'm just not too good for giant robots fighting in the streets.
And call me an old softy, but Optimus Prime and his *sniff sniff* self-sacrifice and nobility just chokes me up.
Come on, it's not like it gets rave reviews from critics or anything, like certain ludicrously popular and poorly written novels. That everyone rushes out to buy the day it comes out. :wallbash:

[Tito]

Well, don't know about you, but I myself never thought big blockbusters, be it films or books, had anything to do with imagination or delivering messages. They are just products intended to make money fast and without much effort or problems. Not works of art, nor samples of creativity. So we could keep thos giant robots and little wizards out of this conversation, as they have nothig to do with it.

About art, don't try to define it. It is such a huge amount of different things that it is completely impossible to label it, or to find an unifying pattern or characteristic in it.

[Playbahnosh]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(rlbell @ Aug 13 2007, 04:10 AM) [snapback]304366[/snapback]</div>

That is quite the statement. Rather than ask you to prove that bald assertion, I will merely ask you to name two of these revolutions that were caused by boredom.
[/b]

Why name two, when you can name them all? Lemme explain. You said revolutions are because people are unhappy. Fine, I go with that for the sake of example. Lets say, that you are unhappy about something right now. Like your neighbor is pumping some phat tunes through the night and you can't sleep. Most of the people won't go calling the police to arrest that mofo being an ignorant turdbucket, then sue the hell out of them. No, not just yet. Maybe it was a one time only thing. At its worst, you only going to mention him that the music was loud, please keep it down. But imagine hearing the music all through the week, until you can hum the bassline of all the songs without practice. And you don't like techno at all. Now THAT'S going to brake your calmness, and make you rebel, taking actions against your neighbor. Why? Because you are BORED of being unhappy. See?

The people of France were unhappy long before the french revolution started. They were bored of living under that government, bored of being abused, and so on. If that situation was to be a one day thing, there wouldn't be any revolution. People need time, until they just can't take it anymore, until they are bored being angry and sad. Same thing with ALL the revolutions. See my point?

This is the very same thing why utopia can't work either. If you read Asimov, saw the Matrix movies or even read the Bible, you can put it all together. Humans are like this. We need change, we have the need for the new, the different. This goes to everything. People having a bad life want something better, something different than they are living in. People having a good life, want something different too than what they are living in. They don't say "Im not unhappy, so I don't want to do anything new". Some rich people even abandoned their wealth, gave away everything to live among monks in Tibet.

So my point is: no change = boredom = revolution. Duh!


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(STFM @ Aug 13 2007, 06:29 AM) [snapback]304370[/snapback]</div>

Then stop going to see big 'blockbuster' movies where the effects are the movie. Go to see more movies where the effects add to the experience rather than make it. There are plenty! The Prestige was a good example in my opinion. Spiderman 3, in my opionion, was one of the worst movies ive ever seen.
[/b]

Yeah, maybe there are still movies that are worth watching, but that is not THAT plenty. I remember times when I strolled into a VHS rental store, I picked a movie off the shelf at random (from the genre I liked to watch) and there was a 80% chance that it was a GOOD movie, with the right mix of story, emotions, effects and meaning. Lasting appeal. Now I walk in a DVD rental store, shuffle through the shelves to find the best possible one, and it is only a 30-40% chance that I won't go to sleep or brake out in a laughing match (on a thriller or drama) after the first ten minutes. And that is pathetic. I see all the shiny CGI, the over-stared actors only to watch a possibly good story ruined by mediocre acting, bad screenplay and even worse directing. And I'm a guy who likes watching good movies. And yes, there are good movies around, I saw one or two this year, but the movie industry is pumping out these these one-week-blockbusters, sweeping the good ones aside. I don't like that. And you can't help watching the 'blockbusters', as you mentioned. They are practically showing them down your throat. Anywhere you turn you see huge posters, TV playing teasers, fast-food joints giving themed foods and toys to kids...and so on. Even if you don't stroll into a movie theater, you will watch half the movie one way or another. Even if you like it or not. Yea, I don't like it either dude :/

[Luchsen]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mighty Midget @ Jul 29 2007, 09:13 PM) [snapback]301846[/snapback]</div>

What about non-graphical computer games? The old school text adventures for instance. Did we benefit from having to imagine it all or does today's graphics help us expanding our imagination
[/b]

k: More professional text adventures! NOW!

One time I thought Amnesia had graphics as I had them in my mind's eye, but I only remembered the images (word family!) I imagined at playing.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(rlbell @ Aug 13 2007, 04:10 AM) [snapback]304366[/snapback]</div>

No one who knows better will want to live in interesting times.
[/b]

I don't know better.


Can't imagine to have no imagination.

[rlbell]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Playbahnosh @ Aug 13 2007, 10:47 PM) [snapback]304528[/snapback]</div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(rlbell @ Aug 13 2007, 04:10 AM) [snapback]304366[/snapback]

That is quite the statement. Rather than ask you to prove that bald assertion, I will merely ask you to name two of these revolutions that were caused by boredom.
[/b]

Why name two, when you can name them all? Lemme explain. You said revolutions are because people are unhappy. Fine, I go with that for the sake of example. Lets say, that you are unhappy about something right now. Like your neighbor is pumping some phat tunes through the night and you can't sleep. Most of the people won't go calling the police to arrest that mofo being an ignorant turdbucket, then sue the hell out of them. No, not just yet. Maybe it was a one time only thing. At its worst, you only going to mention him that the music was loud, please keep it down. But imagine hearing the music all through the week, until you can hum the bassline of all the songs without practice. And you don't like techno at all. Now THAT'S going to brake your calmness, and make you rebel, taking actions against your neighbor. Why? Because you are BORED of being unhappy. See?

The people of France were unhappy long before the french revolution started. They were bored of living under that government, bored of being abused, and so on. If that situation was to be a one day thing, there wouldn't be any revolution. People need time, until they just can't take it anymore, until they are bored being angry and sad. Same thing with ALL the revolutions. See my point?

This is the very same thing why utopia can't work either. If you read Asimov, saw the Matrix movies or even read the Bible, you can put it all together. Humans are like this. We need change, we have the need for the new, the different. This goes to everything. People having a bad life want something better, something different than they are living in. People having a good life, want something different too than what they are living in. They don't say "Im not unhappy, so I don't want to do anything new". Some rich people even abandoned their wealth, gave away everything to live among monks in Tibet.

So my point is: no change = boredom = revolution. Duh!



[/b][/quote]

What does boredom mean to you? The only thing more exciting than worrying about jackbooted thugs hauling you away to prison is when they actually do it. Last I checked, being tortured is very exciting for all of the wrong reasons. No one gets bored of repressive government, except those who benefit from keeping the commons repressed (the ones who are least likely to revolt).

There was plenty of excitement to keep the downtrodden poor of France from being bored-- eking out a living for themselves and their children. Contrary to what you may believe, poverty is not dull. Boredom is a luxury for those who have their basic needs fulfilled.

Asimov was a microbiologist. The further you go from microbiology, the less he knew. With three courses in classical studies and another in twentieth century history under my belt, I am at least as likely to be an authority on revolutions as he is (not to make me out to be an authority, just to show that academic authority is very limited).

The American revolution had several causes: Being taxed to pay for the victorious war fought against the french (from which the colonists were the chief beneficiaries), the Crown's attitude to the catholics of British North America (letting them keep their religion, language, and code of civil laws), and negotiating borders with neighbouring indian tribes, with the goal of establishing aboriginal sovereign nations (thoroughly alarming given that, unlike the revolutionaries, the british actually gave at least some lip service to indian treaties). I find nothing about these causes to be boring.

A key component of boredom is the absence of stress. Without stress, there is no need to revolt. If the biggest complaint that you have about the government is boredom, what are you rebelling against?

If no change is boring, and boredom causes revolutions, please explain the histories of India and China.

[Playbahnosh]

Contrary to what you may believe, poverty is not dull. Boredom is a luxury for those who have their basic needs fulfilled.[/b]

Is that so? Maybe I'm at fault, and "boring" doesn't mean the same thing in all languages. I thought when someone is "bored", it is a feeling, a desire for a change, a different activity, a different FEELING. Apathy can be exiting for all the wrong reasons too you know. When a bored german soldier was walking in the death camp, and he was bored...well there were some interesting happenings there, but not really for him...and definetly not for the inmates. For that soldier, working there for years, shooting a man in the head or making them inmates do something to amuse him, is like switching to a different channel when you are BORED OF WATCHING TV! See my point? I'm not talking about small time boredom, to be facing the dilemma to go shopping or watching a movie. I'm talking about lifestyle like large boredom. Maybe it is because of the lingual differences, but I think if you try, you can understand what I mean. No necessarily agree with it, but simply catch my meaning.

A key component of boredom is the absence of stress. Without stress, there is no need to revolt.[/b]

I beg to differ. A key component of stress IS boredom. Stress is the process of getting bored with annoyance. You don't get stressed out having fun and new things to do, but you get stressed to do the same things over and over again, annoying things. Constant annoyance causes stress, in this case continuity IS the cause of stress, a never ending stride of annoyance. There is the concept to "unwind", to relieve stress. You do that doing something ELSE, to brake the annoyance-stream. You go home, pop out a beer and watch TV, or do anything else BUT stay annoyed. See? For different people, the word "stress" means something else. You can get annoyed by different things, and thus there is different kind of stress. You said, without stress, there is no need to revolt. You are right. Why revolt when you are not constantly annoyed outta your socks rite?

Asimov was a microbiologist. The further you go from microbiology, the less he knew. With three courses in classical studies and another in twentieth century history under my belt, I am at least as likely to be an authority on revolutions as he is (not to make me out to be an authority, just to show that academic authority is very limited).[/b]

Well then, please show me your work. Show me your thousands of pages of award winning, world famous, approved work of literature on phylisophy, phsichology, politology and imagination. If you are at least as likely to be an authority as Asimov is, just because you have degrees, well let's hear it. Asimov is not an authority because he has a degree in microbiology, or any degree for that matter. He is an authority because he made it happen. He stood out in front of the (then) reluctant audiance, and he made his point on the most delicate subjects known to mankind, without any remorse or feelings of guilt. And he knew what he awas talking about. Maybe not all the time, and his theories are not allways necessarily true, but we don't know any better now do we? Don't sheet yourself under your degrees and studies, that's just lame. Bring out reasons dude. I never said that I'm RIGHT about anything, I'm simply trying to have a civilised debate over this issue. I don't have any degrees, but I still have ideas, and I walk the world with open eyes and ears. I meant no offense to you, honest.

Originally posted by Luchsen

No one who knows better will want to live in interesting times.

I don't know better.


Can't imagine to have no imagination.[/b][/quote]

I second that

[chumloofah]

bore 2 (bôr, br)
tr.v. bored, bor·ing, bores
To make weary by being dull, repetitive, or tedious: The movie bored us.
n.
One that is wearingly dull, repetitive, or tedious.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Adj. 1. bored - tired of the world; "bored with life"; "strolled through the museum with a bored air"
world-weary
tired - depleted of strength or energy; "tired mothers with crying babies"; "too tired to eat"
2. bored - uninterested because of frequent exposure or indulgence; "his blase indifference"; "a petulant blase air"; "the bored gaze of the successful film star"
blase
uninterested - not having or showing interest; "an uninterested spectator"


Trying to fundamentally link unhappiness to boredom is absolute nonsense.
You can be unhappy because you're bored, but saying you're bored with being unhappy is word play.
Unhappiness implies things that boredom doesn't allow for.
This is pedantic, but you should use a different word :bleh:
People might do things because they're bored, but so long as they're not unhappy they won't revolt.

Ribell's right about boredom being more common among the classes that have everything they need to survive, which is almost everybody in the "first world".
As a result boredom's at it's historical peak, despite all the distractions.
No revolt though, because despite being bored we're comfortable.

As for the language in the matrix and the bible... I've seen better.
Wouldn't be too comfortable using them as sources. :bleh:


I'm just left wondering where the ability to deliver a message on imagination went?

[Japo]

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(chumloofah @ Aug 14 2007, 01:42 PM) [snapback]304584[/snapback]</div>

I'm just left wondering where the ability to deliver a message on imagination went? [/b]

It's still there, both actually and potentially. Only that most people are happy with a substitute of it, and with short demand there will be short supply.

[Playbahnosh]

@chumloofah

OOOMPF!!! *Playbahnosh drops to the ground and curls up into fetal position* GNNNAH, That hurts!!! gnnnn you bastard....aarrrgh...

[chumloofah]

^ pwnt