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[Lizard]

Originally posted by Sebatianos@Mar 19 2005, 02:15 PM
Now that has got ot be one of the thoughtest questions to answer, but you all know me, I'll make a long and half sensless post about it...

First off I have to say that I think there are only 3 emotions: FEAR, LOVE and HATE. They are all conceted. If you love someone or hate someone enough you'll be able to overcome the fear and do something (either you'll be able to sacrifice your self to save another, or you'll be able to kill your self, just so you'd hurt someone else). But those are extremes now.
So let's talk about love (baby, let's talk about...)
Love is an emotion, but like every emotion it's not eternal! It's everchanging. And even while in love you can feel negative feelings toward the same person as well.
People can love things, ideas, people, themselves,...

When we talk about love towards people it's importaint to know, that not everybody is capable of love. To be able to love, you have to be unselfish enough. Really selfish people (usually also intelectually lower people - IQ betewwn 85-100) put them selves in the first place and can only love something or someone, that pleases them. Apart from that, they lack the capasity for loving another (they also have problems respecting fellow human beings and are usually the main cause of xenophobia, intolerance,...). Yet I said they could love something that pleases them. Unfortunately again they only take their selfish possition and wish to have more and more of that pleasent thing untill they drain it, but can give very little in return.

There is another kind of love, which is unconditional. This is the famous love so emphisised in the human history. Yes, this kind of love exists, but it's exactly this kind of love, that is short lived. No one is flawless, but until you're madly and blindly in love, you don't see that. At that point you create for your self an image of the perfect person, because you wish to attach all the best atributes you can thing of to the person you love. If this is unhapy love and you never come together with that person, then this love is extremely strong (this person didn't show that he/she isn't perfect). If however you are with such a person for a longer time period then you'll see many shortcomings of that person. At the begining you'll admire that person, but will be surprised to see, that person can not melt with you and you can't become one. This means both have their own needs even if very much alike. One wishes to have a romantic evening the other is too tired (this is a classic example). Now the tired one feels the romantic evening as a burden ant the romantic one feelt this is an insoult to the effort. So they start making compromises. At that point the ultimative love starts fading away, because you have to adjust yourself to the needs of another. That's a skill people in the world of today are lacking, thus many fights brake out (maybe people always lacked that skill, but in the past the woman was almost always forced to give in - which was off course wrong).
You still love that person and are prepared to move mountains for him/her, but not to move your own arse while watching your favourite TV show (with only five more minutes till the end, and that person asks you for a srecwdriver/kitchen utility - that is needed at that very moment - you can't keep the wires apart for five more minutes, or you can't hold the boiling pot in your hand for five more minuter - so you do it yourself somehow and resent the incapability of the other to help you).

Then there is the love for the family (which is based on respect and being used to the same people). If a child is taken away from the mother and they meet 20 years later - without knowing who the other one is - they won't feel any love (although biologically they are still a parent and a child). On the other hand children can get attached to their forster parents just as much (sometimes even more) then to their real parents. There's also the category of syblings - there love can be measured in miles the more between them - the bigger the love LOL ).

But I think that the sentance: "You still love that person and are prepared to move mountains for him/her, but not to move your own arse while watching your favourite TV show," really said it all. After a while this is what happens and then you have to start changing (it's all a part of growing up). You need to adjust your self to a frequency that is compatible with the significant other - who also adjusts to that frewuency. If that isn't possible the relationship has to end (otherwise both would just suffer and hold on because of the feeling they used to have and an image of a person that's not real). Also it's importaint that both make this adjustment, otherwise one is in a submisive position. However I must say, that a relationship with one person being subordinate to another could also work - but I'm agains unequality.

If I've been unclear at any (or all) points feel free to ask anything (either in the thread or through PM).

Ehm....WOW BIG!!! OMG
I dont agree very much that intelectually lower people are more selfish.i have met selfish and VERY intelligent people and opposites quite frequently.I think it has much more to do with empathy.(isnt there something like EQ(emphaty/emotion qocient??Or it is just me? )
Also what about patriotism? I dont know if you would definate it as love,but for me there is a love to nation/idealogy.(mostly "ultimate" love,when they dont see possible flaws,their object have)

[Xikarita]

As far as opinions go, I'm with Fruit Pie Jones and Classic Pig. I suppose that also has to do with the age thing, as theirs is closer to my own...
And confusing lust with love is a very common mistake, especially when you feel...in need. :whistle: It has happened to me in the past...

[Sebatianos]

Originally posted by Lizard@Mar 19 2005, 03:31 PM
I dont agree very much that intelectually lower people are more selfish.i have met selfish and VERY intelligent people and opposites quite frequently.I think it has much more to do with empathy.(isnt there something like EQ(emphaty/emotion qocient??Or it is just me? )

What I wanted to say is that both selfish and intelectually lower people (they are not the same group - and I realize that's generalizing, so yes - there ARE EXEPTIONS).

Also what about patriotism? I dont know if you would definate it as love,but for me there is a love to nation/idealogy.(mostly "ultimate" love,when they dont see possible flaws,their object have)

Patriotism isn't really love, but it falls in the category I've mentioned, but haven't talked about much. I said you can love an idea.
The thing is, that you are brought up in a certain sence and with certain values, so if your dedication is strong enough you'll keep pushing your values forward. An attack on those values would at the same time be a personal attack on your self and you'd react. Also at that point you'd find every person who shows that your country has flaws as your personal enemy. If you're a patriot you identify yourself with your country and you put the country in the posisiton where you only attach the positive adjectives to it (just like with the person you love and don't wanna see any flaw that person has).

[Schabernakel-anbeter]

High folks :bye:

1. I think "Patriotism" can be love to your country, but normally it is used to defend
the country or even to start war to another. (only for self protection..of course)
In Germany we called it "National Socialism" for a couple of time. <_<

2. sth to love from person to person:

Love is

not to change a cottage with a palast
forget about mistakes and bad attributes with a smile
and devotion without hesitation
(from book :whistle: )

3. love is totally different to sexual greed

I think its sad that most people just want a girlfriend to show off
or to take part of sexual talking
(respect is where its all about :blink: )

Anyway this is just one part of the Love

"I think love is in everything"

It just depends to you to find it :bye:

@ taikira

I love your avatar :wub:

Do you think she would marry my flip grasshopper LOL

Bye :bye: Bye

[Sebatianos]

Originally posted by Schabernakel-anbeter@Mar 19 2005, 11:29 PM
3. love is totally different to sexual greed

I think its sad that most people just want a girlfriend to show off
or to take part of sexual talking
(respect is where its all about :blink: )

I couldn't agree more k:

[Tulac]

I think that people who search for love, never really find it, then there are people who are in love but don't really know it...
My opinion is that there are a few people that are sure that they are in love...
But that's good because love isn't something that you can produce, it just hits you...
At least from my point of view, or that's how I imagine it...

[Yobor]

I realize, Sebatianos, that ALL of your posts have a deep meaning and a very good point to them.

Sadly, I have not read one that is over 3 paragraphs long.

I am not complaining in any way about the length of your posts. In fact, it is wonderful that you have so much to say about such a wide variety of subjects.

Just don't expect most people to read them
-Erik



The difference between Love and lust is that lust is a purely physical idea, while love is both physical and mental.
-K

[Schabernakel-anbeter]

@ tulac

who searches finds

the question is what LOL

normally you get sth you are not looking for.... :whistle: :angel:

@ sebastianos

thanks for the flowers :wub:

Bye :bye: Bye

[Danny252]

wow, a topic Im constantly reading yet not replying to..
You guys are really great when it comes to discussions like this..
-reads-

[taikara]

@FPJ: I must once again state for the record (though not through Tom this time) that you are my hero!

It's nice to see that not all Americans think in terms of sex, that's so depressing for me.

@ClassicPig: Kudos to you, too for the thoughtful post!

@Sebatianos: I agree, but I tend to think that "unconditional" love is more like the love that allows you to forgive people even when they hurt you, rather than being a "Romeo and Juliet" moving mountains sort of love.

@Schabernakel-anbeter: Respect is key, imho. Not sure about the marriage thing, I think he'd have to talk to her first

Now that a few people have responded, I'm going to try to summarize my feelings...

I tend to agree most with FPJ (which is why he's my hero, I guess, hehe). I think love isn't so much a state of being as it is an action, something that you must always strive to express. I think you do choose who you love, more than you don't. Of course, you can't just choose to love someone randomly (well, you could, but that would be strange :blink, so I think that attraction plays a key as well, whether it be mental attraction or physical attraction.

I personally don't function in terms of physical attraction... I get a mental attraction way faster than I will think of someone as physically attractive, and so I think I sometimes confuse a what should probably stay as a friendly love with what I want for a romantic one, because that's what I find attractive.

Respect, also is HUGE for me in love. I cannot stress it enough. It's one thing to be comfortable with someone, but to be so "comfortable" that you fundamentally disrespect the person is something I find unacceptable. It's more like taking them for granted than true comfortableness.