i agree with a lot of this guy's points!

http://www.pointlesswasteoftime.com/...manifesto.html

I think we would fill more than that actually. :D

Seriously though, it's a very good article. I agree with a lot of his points too. And it's hilarious as well, I laughed all the way through. Thanks for the link. :ok:

Oh yeah that's a funny article very interesting, gave me some laughs. LOL

IT was very clever. Made me laugh. Thanks!

Now I have to get all down and dirty with it: I think that guy (who wrote the article) was putting too much pressure on the gaming corporations. Don't we all want to fix the bitty little problems in our games? Dont we all want a realistic, human-like, intelligent game? WE all do. But its not important enough for us to really care. I think this guy is way too serious about the little problems which we encounter now and then. Ive had all the same problems in the past. But I dont let it all ruin my gaming experience completely. Also, these game upgrades are very advanced and expensive for game corporations to develop. AI which learns? Dont make me laugh. The hard-drive that kind of program would take up is unthinkable. But maybe in the future we can improve these little, annoying chips on our collective shoulder. :kosta:

haha filling big holes with bad videogames.
terrible games arent a new disease, they buried several big holes worth of "E.T" cartridges for atari 2600 in the desert

real A.I would take up a lot of processing power, and need a lot more development work.
bots in multiplayer scenarios show how hard it is to get realistic behaviour!
i think they could work on better 'tricks' that wouldnt be so demanding. like having them duck into cover shouldnt be THAT hard to pull off. the enemies in original half life have a decent go at doing that. he's right to be annoyed that modern games sometimes just have 'rambo' enemies

One of the very big and very real problems that he touches on in the article is patches. If they start making patches available for consoles, the quality of console games (when released) will without a doubt deteriorate very, very fast, since programmers no longer have to finish the games before releasing them. They can always do that later on with a patch, if the game sells well. If it doesn't; well, that's just just too bad for all the people who did buy it. This is common practice with PC games, and has been annoying the hell out of me for years.

Yeah good point, I really hope that we don't see patches for the next-gen versions of consoles but still it looks like it'll probably happen which is sad to see.

I like too mch the article! It's a shame that there isn't a place to sign... i agree totally with which the guy said in that Gamer's Manifesto!

I think that in the next future the AI is not going to be better, because seems that the 3D graphic is enough to sell...

I totally agree with that manifesto, and I hope the gaming industry will change in the future...

The thing about AI (imo) is that it should be appropriate to the character in the game. Sure, a highly trained SAS team should work together, use cover, etc. but a furious demon from the lowest pit of hell should not, it should run straight at you slashing and roaring.
Also, most of his "new game ideas" already exist. Apart from that, yes, a very entertaining article.

I agree with most of the comments, except the first using DOOM3 as an example is not a good argument. I think ID got stuck with the genre of the series and focused more on graphics since that is the selling point nowadays. The monsters in the DOOM series have never been noted for their GPA scores anyway. You can't say that AI hasn't improved either, notice he didn't use Operation Flashpoint as an example for a dumb FPS.

Agree with the patches though quality assurance should be improved, I find patches nowadays might fix a probelm or not in some cases. However in my experience they are morely likely to cause more problems, and hence another patch is need for those and so on and so forth.

I agree that the AI should fit the character, and as Anon pointed out it would've been more fair to use a game as Operation Flashpoint as an example. The thing is that Doom 3 is supposed to be the pinnacle of gaming technology, and still it has crappy AI. And while you might argue that that is because the developers focused almost exclusively on the graphics, that's excactly his point. Although you can find games out there with better AI, it isn't excactly the first priority among most developers.

And, btw, the guy never claims that any of the ideas are new (which they aren't), he merely says that they are the things gamers want in their games.

That said, I must say I found it very interesting to read his copyright rant. I never knew that ideas like that were patented. It just goes to show that it's about time that international copyright laws were heavily revised (especially with regards to software), so that they can serve their original purpose instead of just maintaining the dominance of a few corporations.

So true... :)

Truth and nothing but the truth.

[quote]The thing about AI (imo) is that it should be appropriate to the character in the game. Sure, a highly trained SAS team should work together, use cover, etc. but a furious demon from the lowest pit of hell should not, it should run straight at you slashing and roaring.
Also, most of his "new game ideas" already exist. Apart from that, yes, a very entertaining article.

I like R Havell's points. I was a little too hard on the article. Very entertaining; I think the author made some stupid points and some good ones. All in all, a great piece of work. :ok:

Nice article. Great read and most of it makes sense. I've been hearing a lot of people complaining about the lack of originality in computer games. Hardly any new concepts at all; not out-of-the-box thinking, even from Nintendo, which used to have new concepts all the time...
I guess it's one of the (main) reasons we're all sticking to the old-time-favourites :ok:

After reading that article I got to thinking I wonder what it would be like if Sega was still around making consoles, don't know why just a thought that popped up, maybe there would be more creativity I don't know.

Edit: Yeah I know Sega makes games for other consoles, forgot to mention that above my bad LOL.

well sega still make games, just for other people!

i think the slow death of the arcades has stopped creativity.
remember it was sega who took the military sim technology of 3d cards and used them for their arcade games... which then led to the first P.C 3d cards. that tech didnt spontaneously appear for p.c's.

ironically, in a lot of ways the P.C is the main development form for new tech.. the arcades are mostly about gimmicks and interfaces you wouldnt afford for your p.c or console. the consoles are just cheaper p.c's. xbox for example. the next gen consoles have a different design architecture to a p.c.. but thats just because there are a lot of ways to cook a goose - they dont have anything 'new'

LOLl Me three, THe point abt FInal Fantasy VIII was a good one i was so hyped up abt the graphics but they werent too bad were tehy?

the thing is the arcades were gonna die , why pay money to play when you can play at home for free. back in the days the game cabs for snes games used to have better graphics than the home version (im basing this memory on killer instinct) but even though now you get games like tekken tag which had much better graphics than the ps2 version (and house of the dead is not the same on a home moniter) people arnt fussed.
the only arcade machines that seem to always have someone around them are the dance games.
i think a lot of the things the chap said in the article made a lot of sense. he wants more autosave, and better writing. i hope that the prolification of free and affordable game dev kits plus the huge amount of open source that is always available are going to see a new generation of home coders spring up, companys of 2 or 3 people like back in the days, people who are getting annoyed and want to make adventure and rpg games, even shooters that rely on good writing and story to reach the masses. i hope if the crash he talks about happens it will mean independents who have lower development cost will take over and get some innovation back in the scene.

it was a real bit of hardcore optimization to get anything vaguely resembling killer instict on the SNES!
i remember when it was released everyone was amazed.

http://www.arcade-history.com/history_data...=detail&id=1280

as you can see, the arcade hardware for killer instinct was very advanced.. more advanced than the N64 LOL.

the arcades died out because of greedy operators, in my opinion.. although the machines were getting incredibly expensive, too.

homebrew games exist for some consoles ; there are some decent ones for the dreamcast, etc
mostly the people who want to get into coding, music or graphics for games use the demoscene to showcase what they can do. which is great for demos, not great for homebrew games LOL.
i did notice someone made a nice little FPS game using just pixel shaders, which fits in 96k or so

http://www.theprodukkt.com/kkrieger.html

bought back fond memories seing that killer instinct page! gotta get a working version of mame and get it, the snes version never even came close. amazing what you can do with 100mhz on a dedicated unit.